Ijaz Butt has attacked Chris Broad, he must be getting sick of Pakistanis doing that, over his claims of a lapse of security for the officials.
Probably would have been best if Ijaz had just shut the fuck up.
Attacking people who were attacked while you were sitting at a desk is hardly going to look good.
You can say you disagree with them, you can say that perhaps they were caught up in the moment, but saying that “”All his [Broad's] statements are false. He has now made obnoxious comments.” and “”He says there was no policemen there [but] I think there could be no bigger lie than this because six policemen died and ten are injured.” seems a bit much.
Ijaz, we get that you see things differently, but you look like a bit of a cock saying this, especially as Taufel and Davis have backed Broad up, and the 4th umpire has a bullet hole in his back.
When he had finished Broad bashing he moved on to the conspiracy theory that said the Pakistan team was delayed on purpose so they would not be attacked.
He had this to say on the matter, “It is wrong to suggest that. The same security procedure was followed”, and “The Pakistan team used to leave at the same time as the Sri Lankan team and other officials, but somehow or the other on that day they got a bit late.”
If a reporter states it was an inside job or a conspiracy, he says it was wrong to suggest.
If 3 people from inside the attacks, the attackees if you will, say that the security was lax, he says its all comments are false and no bigger lie.
Interesting that Broad gets him angrier than the statements that some of his people were in the know, and or worse.
The PCB are going to lodge a formal complaint against Chris Broad for the comments.
Broad is thinking of making a formal complaint against the PCB for almost getting his ass shot off.
For some Indian cricket fans there could be no harder side to choose between in an argument than between Chris Broad and the Pakistanis.
it is sad that policemen died
it is true that six policemen died
one of them being an unfortunate traffic warden – being in the wrong place at the wrong time
but it only proves that the security was non-existent
I would have accepted Butt’s argument if he was saying six gunmen were killed
but he cannot say that can he?
Jayawardene has said there was no shots fired back on the gunmen!!! in return.
Not one of them was wounded – they simply walk off. Now Geo TV shows a clip of the gunmen riding past a police van – refuting claims that the area was cordoned off.
No dead bodies, no blood for DNAs – no arrests- and atrocious handling of forensic samples – so very convenient.
this manner of persistent denial is why Pakistan has become and will remain dangerous
tough choice there, chris broad vs pakistanis
Agree with Chinaman though, the denial is the first thing thats offered to anything that happens in Pakistan.
At least he didn’t blame the Indians
Highlight for me was the policeman meant to be looking after the umpires who played dead next to the van.
And then as soon as the terrorists ran off, he got up and hoofed as fast as his fat gut would allow him, leaving Broad and co inside.
Classic
Apparently Broad told that policeman that LB mentions to drive them out of there, to which he replies “I don’t drive”
Butt has also stated in the past that visiting players would be given Presidential style protection. I’m not sure if this means driving 10 k’s through the city on a standard bus guarded by 6 policeman with old weapons in the back of a ute
Shot at or not, pissed off or not, Broad was a bit needlessly aggressive. A point well made on this blog was that 6 people were killed. Forget cricket. Forget protecting cricketers or umpires. You can’t place greater or lesser value on the life of the security forces than you might on a sportsman or official. It’s something that’s been overlooked far too much in the wake of this tragic event. Once safe and sound in Manchester airport, it can be said that he should perhaps have been more mindful of his comments.
Ian, I’m not saying I disagree with you, but given the circumstances don’t you think that’s a wee bit harsh? He’s a match referee who got shot to shit in a van. I’m only speaking for me sen here, but I’d be fairly vexed.
The PCB made a mistake by giving rubbish security to the cricketers and officials. They owe it even to the policemen who died. Now they are countering by attacking Broad. How about investigating into how this huge fuckup happened?
jrod, I am an Indian fan and I find both sides equally obnoxious . Chris Broad has been obnoxious. You can say the same of Ijaz Butt. The security was lax and Broad could have made his point in a better manner rather than resorting to obnoxious verbal attacks Well, King Kumar did that, didnt he? Mahela managed to put his point across without being rude, didnt he? Maybe, there is somethign for Mr Broad to learn from the ‘orientals’?
Raj, Being that Broad was complaining that the players were better protected than the officials, a major part of his complaint, you’d expect him to angrier than the Lankans, wouldn’t you?
Also, Initially there were reports that Broad lay on top of another umpire to protect the said umpire. Broad says a policeman lay on top of him because the policeman was a coward – now, if the policeman wanted to be safe, wouldnt he rather have Broad lay on his top rather than other way around? And what about those reports about Broad laying on top (er..this is getting rather sleazy) of another umpire. So, it’s like Broad lay over the umpire and then the policeman lay over Broad? Is this the umpire who is critical now? If so, does bearing the weight of Chris Broad and another policeman worsen his condition?
actually he is right
But, jrod, thats just immature of him. There was a rocket launcher attack on the players’ bus not the officials’ bus. The grenade was thrown at the players. Mahela and co. escaped by sheer providence not because of better security. Thats why I find Broad’s missives tasteless and insensitive – this is not the time for him to be complaining about better security for players because thats simply not true.
Raj, immature, he was in a terrorist attack, and he was angry. I tend to stay on the side of the angry man in the attack, he gets a bit more leeway to say what he wants.
Jay, I can agree it was maybe a little harsh, but the first time I heard the interview, all I could think of was how harsh that statement of no security was to the families of the dead, how he was effectively saying they had failed. Can’t say I’ve ever been shot at, so I guess as Jrod suggests above that he deserves more leniency from me (hell who am I to criticise anyone in the wake of this), but it seems that at a time like this, both sides shouldn’t be taking cheap shots at each other. Ijaz Butt was a lot worse than Broad (though I haven’t heard the full interview with him – only excerpts), I just think they’re both missing the point a bit. Scoring points off each other is letting the terrorists cause the disruption they sought to.
Every word that Ian has written, I agree with. Beign that Broad was shot at , I can see jrod’s point that you’d allow him to say what he wants however, I’d expect better from a person holding a position that calls for calm and mature thinking. Having said that, one cant expect that from Broad – just because he holds a position that calls for calm and mature thinking, doesnt mean he has that. Basically, this guy doesnt deserve to be a match referee and in fact, shouldnt have been there in Lahore in the first place so bad luck you got into ICC in the first place, Chris.
I liked Simon Taufel’s press conference. He made the same points but in a nicer manner.
As for Ijaz Butt, his brains are in his…….butt !! Entire Pak is in denial that this happened becuase of their home grown terrorists and their own lack of promised security. Nothing will ever improve in the country if they can’t even accept the problem.
terrible choice
Butt is just a poor cousin of Modi………. Broad more smart than Hair……..
Rascist better than Fascist??
Fucker better than Fucktards??
For us Broad and Butt just seems like a name and surname……… “Broad Butt”
once more, on behalf of pakistan, i apologize for our nation’s absurd levels of denial, manifested by the asshole who leads our board.
to put butt into perspective, consider the fact that this is the same man who had hired javed miandad in a job title he never specified beyond a one line e-mail, and then refused to pay him the amount he was owed after he had been working on the job for three months, and then finally claimed that miandad was bitter cuz he wanted more money.
imagine someone treating the Don like that in Australia, or Sachin/Sunny in India… unfortunately, had this happened in other countries, their fans and people would have displayed enough respect to be outraged. we were non-plussed, almost expected it to happen.
i think its unfair to criticize broad, because he actually lay down over the shot fourth umpire to save his life. the van he was traveling in had absolutely no security. and this is in a country where the wife of the governor in the province this incident happened has a 10-car convoy protecting her when she goes for her kitty parties. so really, regardless of whether broad knew these facts or not, someone had to get up and bollock the pakistani authorities.
and finally, the commissioner of Lahore admitted on TV that the security provided was not adequate, nor was it presidential level. this is important because the security details were his responsibility, not ijaz butt’s, who could only request for it, but could not guarantee it. so it boggles the mind why mr. butt decided to go on the offensive in the first place.
all it suggests to me is that like most pakistanis, especially those in power, he is in such abject denial that even a brazen attack like this has failed to jolt him into reality.
karachi, just want to get clarification on contradicting claims: one report says Broad protected an umpire by laying over him, another report quotes Broad saying that a policeman lay over him – but the twist is here this is seen not as protecting Broad but cowardice.
Which of this is true?
If both are true, can we have some consistency – either Broad and the policeman both are cowards or both are heroic? It is fascinating isnt it the way these reporting works – for performing Act A, when Broad is reported performing that act, it is reported as heroic. When the same Act A, when it is reported as being performed by a policeman, it is reported as cowardice. What exactly is different between the policeman and Broad to deserve this discriminative reporting?
karachikhatmal, Sir, you are wise.
Raj, I’m sure there’s going to be a shit load more discrepency in reporting, it’s the nature of the beast. In regards to your point the difference between Broad and the policeman, is one of them is a pasty 51 year old match referee and one of them is an armed police officer charged with shooting eejits who shoot at pasty 51 year old match referrs.
raj,
while you nit-pick over semantics, without actually knowing just what happened or who really said what, and obviously having no idea of whether anyone was a hero or a coward, another “oriental” ( quaint term, hey) called Murali has made similar accusations about the security.
I would have thought, anyway, that regardless of what Broad or any cricketer said, an apology was first due by the PCB to all involved for the terrible shock they suffered. Many sporting boards hosting international events would be ashamed to have allowed such a thing to happen – but perhaps pakistanis really do have something to hide – why else try to distract attention from their own failings
“while you nit-pick over semantics, without actually knowing just what happened or who really said what, and obviously having no idea of whether anyone was a hero or a coward, another “oriental””
Well, then. Can we go back to the “Tullamarine-LalitModi-BCCI-planes-in-waiting-Indian-team-flexing-muscles” incident and say unequivocally that people who were making that claim were saying that without knowing just what happened or who really said what?
Thought not.
I didnt call anyone a coward or a hero – I was merely quoting two reports yet you have to advise me that I am talking about something I dont know – would you apply the same to the ‘experts’ who quote the tullamarine thingy – mind, many of them are ‘respected’ bloggers.
Raj. you did call Broad “immature” and “obnoxious” because he was pissed off about being shot at. You also implied his comments were motivated by racism, not by being pissed off at being shot at. Now I’m old enough to remember Broad bat (or at least old enough to remember myy dad screaming “get off the field you bolshy cunt!” when he had one of his many fits of petulance*). He was and is a bolshy cunt, but I think in this case, from what I’ve read from international news sources and “respected bloggers” he seems justified.
You just seem to be being a bolshy cunt to make some paranoid point about Broad’s prejudice against “orientals”, which I think is both untrue and irrelevant.
*Broad, not my dad, although they both have their moments.
@steve – did the english board apologise to the the australians when london was burning? criticizing pakistan for its denial is one thing, another to implore they should grovel for what has happened. the sri lankan players more than anyone else knew the risks. and if the security was not felt to be the adequate, concerns should have been raised. murali and broad don’t get brownie points for stating the obvious after the fact.
Jay, calling names, eh? It always boils down to this – I never call anyone names. If you notice closely, I have merely talked about reporting of this news not about Chris Broad – Broad is obviously not responsible if the reports are contradictory. If I have to talk about Broad’s bias, there are other incidents. I have found that there is no point talking about them because, by merely questioning certain incidents, I become racist and the ones who actually practice it are hailed.
Couple of points I made:
* Both SL players and Broad were faced with a shock and SL players reacted more gracefully. The reference to ‘orientals’ was in the context of he can learn better from what his type usually dismisses as ‘orientals’.
* The reporting of Broad’s reactions and the Policeman’s actions both highlighted the same action performed by the two of them in different light – this is obviously a critique of the assumptions and bias inherent in such reporting as highlighted here by me,. not a critique of Broad. Now, if you want to brush that under the carpet, please feel free to. But that bias is there for objective people to see.
Apart from this, Chris Broad has clearly shown himself to be partial to players from certain countries in the past – again, there is no point me regurgitating that here becuase, jrod apart, I see very few bloggers of a certain demographic willing to engage with such facts.
And what I find is while I present such an argument at an intellectual level, I get called names and end up being blamed while in truth, the ones that descend to calling names are the ones who are not able to answer my questions logically.
Jay, thanks for bringing the bolshy cunt into this. It highlights the ridiculousness of commentators such as raj trying to point score over miniscule issues in this tragedy. Broad, as we all know, was shot at. The poor bugger, along with the other umpires have an absolute right to feel fucking pissed off after being deserted in the roundabout. I have never been shot at, however would reckon that if I was, I would be bordering on the “slightly pissed off and aggressive” stance of Broad. End of story. To compare it to the fucking monkey gate is embarrassing, ridiculously unimaginative and pathetically stupid. raj, stop making a fight out of this tragedy, you end up looking like tony greig
poopsie, in a civil society, there are different points of view. Learn to appreciate different points of view. I am not happy about that incident. It was unfortunate and sympathies to Broad. Having said that, I have a right to question certain practices in this context or any other context. If jrod asks me to shut my trap on this, I will. Firstly, you dont understand my comments, and then you descend down to calling names. Now, who is ‘fighting’ and who is merely ‘debating’?
jrod, please note that I havent called anyone names or descended down to barbs of poor taste, or made personal attacks on anyone. On the other hand, I have been subject to pathetic personal attacks. I just hope you notice the difference.
Raj, i am not saying you do not have the right to question whatever “certain practices” you see in the lahore tragedy. I just don’t see what “certain practices” you can pull out of an attempted murder? You also classically brought “ciivl society” into the argument -not sure how calling Broad a racist and by his “whiteness” deserved to be shot at belongs in any “civil society”? You may not want to get into name calling implicitly, yet you do by insinuation. It pisses me off to actually comment on your argument because you are doing the reverse-discrimination bogie better than Flavor Flav! What I am saying, categorically and without stuttering, flinching or sneezing, is that you are so wrong that you come off looking as well informed as a Jackman-Greig love child. Just stop on the Broad issue
Raj, Jesus Christ man, look at your posts… “Obnoxious”, “Immature” ,”His type”. That’s not calling names? “His type”? That’s only not name calling in 1950s Tennesse, and then you set up the “oriental” straw man. I don’t know you so I don’t know your agenda, but mate, it’s looking a bit fucked up from your writings.
Here is a classic from Miadad: . “The ICC must ban Broad from standing in any matches,” he said. “He has intentionally tried to damage the image of Pakistan and isolate it as a cricket nation. He is twisting things. He is trying to scare away teams from playing in Pakistan.”
Yeah right – had Broad not said anything, I would have taken my family for a tour of downtown Karachi.
Well, further name calling. And insinuation that I said broad deserved to be shot. Who is insinuating and facricating here? Amazing, anyone has a contrarian point of view, attack him personally and try to discredit him with almost goebbelsian propoganda. Why can’t you address my logical arguments instead? Heard of democracy ?
Jay and poopsie , you have shown poor understanding of english. I said sympathies to broad. Which part of that is not understandable – jesus, now I can understand what other nation cricketers go through _ insinuation, lies, sledges based on fabrication – and amazingly you guys still think you are paragons of virtue
Raj, so you’re a contrarian, well that makes sense. Did you mean that you have a contradictory point of view by any chance? words, mate, they have power, use them wisely and not ignorantly because you think they sound good. Then again, I’m a nazi apperantly and an illiterate one at that, then again, you don’t call people names do you? or answer people’s simple questions. I was wondering what George W Bush was doing post retirement, now I know. Keep this going you’ll have a syndicated radio show, you could call it “begging the question”, or “Raj’s logical fallacy hour”.
You could just be trying to wind me up with your verbose bombast, in which case, well done, I’ve fallen for it.
[...] week’s attack on the Sri Lankan cricket team, according to an interview published Saturday. Ijaz misplaces his anger – cricketwithballs.com 03/05/2009 Ijaz Butt has attacked Chris Broad, he must be getting sick of [...]
Wow, Raj, where did it all go wrong? Actually I read right through this post and I’ll be fucked if I can see it. Sorry, Jay, sorry, Poopsie, I don’t get what you are attacking Raj for. Broad did say he lay on top of the other umpires and journos did say he was a hero, and Broad also said that after the shooting stopped a copper jumped in the van and lay on top of all of them and Broad said that was cowardice. Haiving said that, there isn’t any actual inconsistency there because Broad never said he was hero, someone else did.
Broad, also, is a bolshy cunt. I remember the petulant, priveledged white man kicking his toys out of the cot – actually smashing the stumps down with his bat – whenever he got out(that’s right racists you just heard a white man insult another white man by calling him a white man – stick that in your sociology lecture and smoke it). He is a self-obsessed self-righteous wanker, and he’s a fucked referee for the self-same reasons. Agreed, Jrod, he might have been a little upset, dare I say a little bit fwightened and wanting his mummy after being shot at, but seriously his job is supposed to be a leadership position, and a good leader right now would be calm and measured in their statements. As examples I give you King Kumar (good) and the Buttman (bad).
Calm and measured. Clearly no-one commenting here is going to be a match referee anytime soon!
these days someone has to scream and shout
or the world no longer listens
what Sangakkara etc said politely – will soon be forgotten
does Broad have a reason to shout about?
too right he has.
he is the one who took the risk to travel to Pakistan based on the reassurances of proper security, not us –
we are sitting in the safety of our armchairs – criticising without knowing the
minutes and seconds of the events as they happened.
this is not about Broad’s past or his personality
this is about that instant when the terrorists fired – and what followed
the evidence left behind now suggests the gunmen were prepared for a seige – taking hostages
- they would not intent to take the entire team as hostages – easier to manage would be a smaller group , the likely hostages would be the smaller group of foreign referees.
the SL players were to be blasted to bits – their bus hit with grenade launchers
everyone here must be aware
of the usual outcome of an islamic terrorist taking hostage –
the blindfolded video clips – of them on knees, begging for mercy –
and the eventual beheadings – LIVE on the internet
would anyone of you like your friends and family to be helpless witness to your own killing?
Chris Broad came within minutes of becoming such a hostage victim
He has simply voiced his anger,
if it was I, I would have been kicking buts in public – in front of the world’s TV cameras.
even if the above is true
it has got nothing to do with this event – it does not make his life worth any less
the ONLY reality here is
Pakistan had invited Sri Lanka and promised them their personal safety
if they were incapable of providing them that safety – then the promises were blatant lies.
those who are trying to judge Broads actions and reactions to this incident
I find all the sanctimonious garbage revolting –
for it does not criticise the person or organisation that made empty or untrue promises
it deviates the focus to one who has the courage to vent his anger in public.
Incidentally, the ‘elite’ policeman who peeked into the van was asked to drive the van away from the scene – he had replied “can you not drive it yourself” -
that probably is presidential style security Pakistani style –
it is enough to make every sane individual to feel angry enough to shout in anger
Ned, you’re right, I was pissed off and pissed. I think reading Raj’s post made me chanel 30 years of pent-up anger at pseudo-intellectuals, as I said, I don’t know Raj personally so I might be being unfair, if this is a case Raj, I apologise. I would suggest though that you learn the meaning of words before criticising others of “not understanding English”.
I know Chris Broad is a bolshy cunt, for the reasons Ned said, I was just vexed that racism was brought into the debate. In this case it *is* irrelevant.
Chinaman, I agree.
“He is a self-obsessed self-righteous wanker, and he’s a fucked referee for the self-same reasons”
ned, this is a brilliant call. You have cured me of many wounds by being a white man whoc calls the shit of another white man. For that reason, I am willing to salute your balls and sign the truce.
Just for the record, I was railing at the reporting of Broad’s role not at Broad himself – I was angry that this was turned into a reverse racism debate and a charge that I was accusing Broad of racism in this context. I can accuse him of that in another context , which Ned has captured brilliantly but not this one.
Also, people have quoted Javed Miandad partially here – his context was that when Broad was impressed with the security arrangements(presumably in an earlierr tour), he refused to make that public quoting iCC regulations – Javed is pissed off that he chose to publicly comment on the security arrangements now. While the context of being shaken is understandable, it does paint Broad in double standards – why should he hide behind ICC regulations for commenting positively on the security arrangements(in the past instance) but forget that conveniently now. What it tells is that he evokes the regulations to suit his personal needs.